Why aren't more members posting?

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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by skfarblum on Thu Apr 05, 2012 3:28 pm

Dear Mac,
I admire your sentiments.Kindness to others is in my way of seeing
things never ever wasted.Kindness just keeps going and without
you knowing, your kindness has possibly helped some other needy soul.
Truly beautiful.Thank you for the memory.
Stephen
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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by Quiet on Thu Apr 05, 2012 5:17 pm

skfarblum wrote:Dear KatyKing,
Thanks.I have read Watts.I never could really see things his way.
I quite agree with you the roots of "I-am" lie in spirit.
Spirit to me is an unknowingness.The knowledge of being comes for me
at I-am.I use the word I-am only because I have no other way of describing it.

Perhaps if I say" I am that in which all appearances appear may help."
And dear KatyKing,there is nothing profound about this or me.
It just seems like good common sense.After all everything seems to relative
to me.
I learnt some of this from Stewart Edward White in the book "The Unobstructed Universe".You may know it.
His late wife Betty had come through their good friend Joan and had asked
the question what is the one thing you can be certain off?
She very emphatically emphasized that it was that sense of "I-am"
She went on to explain one of the most important things humans need to
develop is a strong sense of this "I" as a core-self as this is what aids us
when we depart this body.
In "The Betty Book" and in "Across the Unknown"The Invisbles"(these were her guides)
again and again insisted that to
confront this core-self is an essential in our spiritual growth.Although nobody would force this realization on us.
Stephen

I was struck by the words I have made bold in your post and wondered if those words are simply another way of acknowledging that we are inherently spirit.

I am. I am spirit. This is perhaps a way of acknowledging the divine spark within each of us.

From what I understand, if we all 'knew' this - that we are inherently spirit - and acted accordingly to the degree that we can, the world would be a very different place.

And maybe that key piece of knowledge - that we each are inherently spirit - is the first step towards our enlightenment as human beings as well.

Quiet


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by obiwan on Thu Apr 05, 2012 5:26 pm

hiorta wrote:Obi, I attended the funeral, but elapsed time like this rarely registers. It must be at least 5 years. Her unexpected apearance was a surprise and a delight to me
This is an aspect of Spiritualism where a 'returning soul' has an advantage with knowledge present on both sides of the veil. Presumably this must help the one who has passed. I had hoped to get an opportunity to discuss the event, but it doesn't look likely.
I remember in the early days of seeking, although I was well enough read, my Dad used to come just around the time of the Healing Service within a Service and the trademark heart attack was always his visiting card plus a sense of him.

The impact of this condition quickly reduced from very heavy to feather light as he learned to control it.
In turn, we will need to learn the same points.
Thanks Hiorta. I have to say using a heart-attack as a trademark seems a bit odd to me. Also, unless a person cannot control it, why use such a sensation which is unpleasant. One might have expected after 5 years a person could have either learned to control the impact they have on others or find a better way to signify their presence don't you think? It is an interesting experience though, thank you.

obiwan


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by obiwan on Thu Apr 05, 2012 5:31 pm

mac wrote:"This is an aspect of Spiritualism where a 'returning soul' has an advantage with knowledge present on both sides of the veil. Presumably this must help the one who has passed. I had hoped to get an opportunity to discuss the event, but it doesn't look likely."

I apologise if this is off-topic but hiorta's account reminds me of a vividly striking event some years back. I have a friend who, like me, is a long-term Spiritualist. She is also crippled by osteo-arthritis but had tried all manner of so-called remedies looking for relief. She had had spiritual healing from friends (which helped temporarily) and eventually tried a certain colour-healing treament in which I helped her.

After a few times there was no evidence of improvement and one evening we sat discussing the situation. As we sat there I felt sure there was help to hand and I suggested this to her. She was willing to try and I wasn't wrong. Shortly after she said she could feel a change. After tat she was able to raise her arm (which had been near-paralysed by the pain of her condition) high above her head and she broke into floods of tears that she had done it for the first time in years. She was so improved she decided she wanted to take a bath and wash her hair, something she'd been unable to do by herself. I left promising to contact her the following day and offering to sit with her again.

It wasn't to be. The relief was temporary (no surprise) but I could not persuade her to sit with me again. That was years ago and no similar opportunity has ever presented itself again. Seemingly a once-in-a-lifetime event but the memory of it has remained vivid in my mind.

Oh how I wish I could have done more....


I hesitate to say this because I am certain you know it already, but; perhaps you did the most that was possible for that person. I don't think even folk like Mr Lang/George Chapman and Harry Edwards claimed to have a 100% cure rate or 100% stay-fixed rate.

Even techniques such as acupuncture don't seem to work in the same way for everyone or even in the same way for the same person sometimes.

The only thing you could control there was whether or not you tried to help. Not the outcome.

obiwan


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by mac on Thu Apr 05, 2012 5:57 pm

obiwan wrote:
mac wrote:"This is an aspect of Spiritualism where a 'returning soul' has an advantage with knowledge present on both sides of the veil. Presumably this must help the one who has passed. I had hoped to get an opportunity to discuss the event, but it doesn't look likely."

I apologise if this is off-topic but hiorta's account reminds me of a vividly striking event some years back. I have a friend who, like me, is a long-term Spiritualist. She is also crippled by oste..................o sit with me again. That was years ago and no similar opportunity has ever presented itself again. Seemingly a once-in-a-lifetime event but the memory of it has remained vivid in my mind.

Oh how I wish I could have done more....


I hesitate to say this because I am certain you know it already, but; perhaps you did the most that was possible for that person. I don't think even folk like Mr Lang/George Chapman and Harry Edwards claimed to have a 100% cure rate or 100% stay-fixed rate.

Even techniques such as acupuncture don't seem to work in the same way for everyone or even in the same way for the same person sometimes.

The only thing you could control there was whether or not you tried to help. Not the outcome.

On your last paragraph I agree, obi. I did what I could by encouraging her when I did.

The regret that I couldn't do more, though, comes from the emotion that perhaps if I'd tried harder to persuade my friend to try again, things might have been different. Maybe I failed to recognise I was meant to keep trying? No-one can resolve that for me so it remains a source of regret.

I accept that any healing may only mean a degree of temporary relief and did not expect a cure or even lasting relief....

mac


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by obiwan on Thu Apr 05, 2012 6:04 pm

mac wrote:
obiwan wrote:
mac wrote:"This is an aspect of Spiritualism where a 'returning soul' has an advantage with knowledge present on both sides of the veil. Presumably this must help the one who has passed. I had hoped to get an opportunity to discuss the event, but it doesn't look likely."

I apologise if this is off-topic but hiorta's account reminds me of a vividly striking event some years back. I have a friend who, like me, is a long-term Spiritualist. She is also crippled by oste..................o sit with me again. That was years ago and no similar opportunity has ever presented itself again. Seemingly a once-in-a-lifetime event but the memory of it has remained vivid in my mind.

Oh how I wish I could have done more....


I hesitate to say this because I am certain you know it already, but; perhaps you did the most that was possible for that person. I don't think even folk like Mr Lang/George Chapman and Harry Edwards claimed to have a 100% cure rate or 100% stay-fixed rate.

Even techniques such as acupuncture don't seem to work in the same way for everyone or even in the same way for the same person sometimes.

The only thing you could control there was whether or not you tried to help. Not the outcome.


The regret that I couldn't do more, though, comes from the emotion that perhaps if I'd tried harder to persuade my friend to try again, things might have been different. Maybe I failed to recognise I was meant to keep trying? No-one can resolve that for me so it remains a source of regret.

.
You can tie yourself up in knots pondering stuff like that. I am not sure why you feel you have any obligation to persuade your friend. After all they did experience some relief and then decided not to take it further. I understand the point you're making though.

obiwan


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by mac on Thu Apr 05, 2012 6:20 pm

"You can tie yourself up in knots pondering stuff like that. I am not sure why you feel you have any obligation to persuade your friend. After all they did experience some relief and then decided not to take it further. I understand the point you're making though."


obiwan

I could tie myself up in knots, my duck friend, but I don't and most of my life is simple and predictable.

But at other times I feel that something different from the boring norm has happened. I'm pretty dense and I may wish later that I had done things differently. OK lots of folk might say the same but I'm meaning this in connection with these 'special' events.

I do know that on certain other of these special occasions, the outcome has been pretty amazing so it's against those times that I compare the one I've related.


mac


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by obiwan on Thu Apr 05, 2012 6:56 pm

Understood.

obiwan


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by hiorta on Thu Apr 05, 2012 6:59 pm

Hi Obi.
""I have to say using a heart-attack as a trademark seems a bit odd to me"" Obi

My apologies if I failed to make the point clear, Obi. The condition occurs naturally when the spirit resumes - temporaily - earth conditions. It's much like some folk who return to their birthplace and all the memories flood back in. Soon it's as though they'd never been away. Folk on a Healing vibration register this automatically, though I don't know whether a Clair - audiant or voyant, would. Quite likely the spirit individual may not realise at first.
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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by obiwan on Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:25 pm

Hi hiorta.
Understood. Thank you for clarifying what you mean.

obiwan


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by skfarblum on Fri Apr 06, 2012 3:23 am

Dear Quiet,
Yes,indeed.Nicely said.
I did not mention this before.
For me my sense of I am is a means of
transcending what I appear to be viz. a
body and the story of a supposed life.


Stephen
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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by _Leslie_ on Fri Apr 06, 2012 8:53 am

Turned into a really insightful thread this, amazing how discussions can develop.
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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by Admin on Fri Apr 06, 2012 9:11 am

Hi Leslie I think we have a really insightful and thoughtful group on here if we ignore wcc the T
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Admin
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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by Loneblossom on Fri Apr 06, 2012 10:09 am

I am lurking a bit but enjoying what I'm reading.

Mac - regarding trying to help the lady - she was the one who closed down and refused your further assistance for her own reasons. People refuse help from others for a whole variety of reasons, regardless how persuasive the offer of help is.
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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by KatyKing on Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:25 pm

You did what you could when you could mac that's all anyone can do and you never know... maybe more benefit accrued from your doing what you could than you thought then or think now.
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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by mac on Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:31 pm

Loneblossom wrote:I am lurking a bit but enjoying what I'm reading.

Mac - regarding trying to help the lady - she was the one who closed down and refused your further assistance for her own reasons. People refuse help from others for a whole variety of reasons, regardless how persuasive the offer of help is.

All this is true BUT for every such suggestion I know inside me that I could - maybe should - have tried a little harder. Had I done so who knows what the outcome might have been? If the offer continued to be declined then I could have backed away knowing I'd gone that extra mile..... But I didn't. Crying or Very sad

But we digress and it was hiorta's point about opportunity that I was following. I cited my own example as an example of a once-in-a-lifetime occurrence which left us wishing we could have gone further....

mac


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by mac on Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:42 pm

KatyKing wrote:You did what you could when you could mac that's all anyone can do and you never know... maybe more benefit accrued from your doing what you could than you thought then or think now.

Maybe so but one judges as humankind based on what is seen or felt. If there was a benefit I'm not aware of it so the regret will persist...

It may be that such experiences may leave us partly-primed for other opportunities so I won't just switch off and say to myself: "You did all you could." I'm mindful that any apparent opportunity to help is not to be wasted - for the sake of that individual.

It's less of a dilemma for those who are in a position of regularly serving others.

mac


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by KatyKing on Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:57 pm

Healing course we use teaches AAR an after action review. Ask....
What went well
How do I know
What did not go well
Why do I know
What could have been done better
How might I implement positive change next time
What do I need to do in order for those changes happen... now... mid term... long term.
AAR is a constant practice towards cultivating a mindset of acceptance that there's never an intervention that could not be improved upon.
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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by mac on Fri Apr 06, 2012 3:00 pm

KatyKing wrote:Healing course we use teaches AAR an after action review. Ask....
What went well
How do I know
What did not go well
Why do I know
What could have been done better
How might I implement positive change next time
What do I need to do in order for those changes happen... now... mid term... long term.
AAR is a constant practice towards cultivating a mindset of acceptance that there's never an intervention that could not be improved upon.

That's fine for practitioners but I'm not a healer.... Wink

mac


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by Quiet on Sun Apr 08, 2012 6:25 pm

I think a forum like this should reflect diversity in subject and style and we seem to have begun to do this, to my delight.

I think such an approach invites others to join in, although it might not altogether please some long time members who enjoy more serious and perhaps conservative approach. Lightness of heart does not equate to shallowness of thought and knowledge by any means, however.

And people do have different ways of thinking and very different communication styles. I hope that people understand that. I have noticed a bit of sniping on the forum which seems to have its roots in some of this.

There is a place for everyone surely and the community of interest is abroad one. The more diverse we are, the more likely we are to attract input from new members or silent members, perhaps.

I value each and every contribution, although in some areas I clearly have nothing to contribute. I am not a flippant person but I think that sometimes a little flippancy, humour and the odd diversion doesn't hurt.

Humour often does reflect significant depth which is interesting to explore. I'm sure humour exists in the next dimension as well, though we don't often hear it in mediumship or trance lectures. Probably there just isn't time.

In a circle I was part of once, there was a wonderful Englishwoman in her 80s who was a natural medium. She quite frequently used to hear things casually in our circle and pass them on, even though she had little knowledge of how important they were. My own mother sometimes used to communicate with me through Jean, and her particular humour was instantly recognisable to me Smile.

When Jean was there, it was like spirit came to have a cup of tea, a chat and a bit of an affectionate laugh. The more 'serious' messages would come through other more serious mediums.

It used to really irritate our teacher sometimes. Yet some of the most authentic messages would come through Jean. I learned a lot from her about how natural mediumship can be and how to remain open to the gentle everyday communication that is possible. She was a gentle, beautiful soul.

So there is a place for all approaches in this forum, I hope. That means a place for lateral discussion as well as the more formal didactic approach. I value both.

Quiet


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by KatyKing on Sun Apr 08, 2012 6:38 pm

Well said Q. Doris Stokes commenting on a particularly stiff and starchy church committee called them...
the frozen chosen.
Spiritualism's the broadest of 'churches' with room for all sorts.
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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by mac on Sun Apr 08, 2012 6:57 pm

"I think a forum like this should reflect diversity in subject and style and we seem to have begun to do this, to my delight."
I agree - the 'Chit-Chat' forum is fine for all manner of subjects, all modes of presentation.

"....although it might not altogether please some long time members who enjoy more serious and perhaps conservative approach." agreed - I'm one of those members I reckon and the 'Chit-Chat' forum is one I contribute less to, preferring more serious subjects....

"And people do have different ways of thinking and very different communication styles. I hope that people understand that. I have noticed a bit of sniping on the forum which seems to have its roots in some of this." Again the 'Chit-Chat' forum is the least formal in its approach. I see nothing wrong in "sniping" at the views of others in this forum as it's a catch-all forum - anything goes, humour included, as long as website rules are not contravened....

"There is a place for everyone surely and the community of interest is abroad one. The more diverse we are, the more likely we are to attract input from new members or silent members, perhaps." Of course there's room for all but it's a Spiritualism focused website. New members are to be encouraged but not when their interest is about unrelated, or incompatible, subjects. There are many other websites, many alternative forums, out there for the expression of views - I'm a contributor to some of them too. But I come to this and other Spiritualism focused websites to discuss Spiritualism. If we're going to include forums for other spiritual approaches then the primary focus could soon become lost if new members were then to pile in....

"So there is a place for all approaches in this forum, I hope. That means a place for lateral discussion as well as the more formal didactic approach. I value both." absolutely - The 'Chit-Chat' forum where we're posting now is right for just about anything.

oops! General Chat forum - it's called 'Chit Chat' elsewhere.... Embarassed

mac


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by Left Behind on Sun Apr 08, 2012 7:31 pm

I agree with all you said, Quiet, with the exception that humour doesn't often come through in trance. I'm currecntly reading Arthur Findlay's Where Two World's Meet, and spirit is mentioned there as frequently trying to get the Circle members laughing. Indeed, they say that it helps them to establish contact.

Left Behind


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by Quiet on Sun Apr 08, 2012 7:35 pm

Thanks for your response Mac.

'Spiritualism' is abroad subject. It ranges from the serious study of physical phenomena to matters of daily living .... and everything in between. In this part of the world many people who attend services do so not because of the more scientific, academic aspect of Spiritualism but to see mediumship and to hear a good speaker on a topic of interest - usually to do with some aspect which vitally affects them . I went to a service yesterday and the topic was death but it covered a broad range of issues and was simple yet articulate.

'Chit chat' is also open to interpretation. I don't know for sure what you mean by that but I suspect that you might not like casual diversions in threads.

However, I see those casual diversions sometimes as really important parts of the dialogue for a whole range of reasons. They might throw a different light on an issue. They may support someone in an indirect but very effective way.

Sometimes a couple of people might take the topic in a different direction which is worthwhile but may not be of interest to the original poster, and sometimes two or three people might get into an apparently exclusive conversation and that can be a little off-putting. It may not be off-putting if you imagine yourself just listening with the freedom to join in or redirect politely at any time.

I can see how 'chatting' might be seen that way as well but don't think this happens all that much in this forum because it does have quite a small membership. If the forum got a lot bigger there might be need to rules about keeping on topic and Moderators to enforce those. I used to belong to a large forum where that was indeed the case.

If you want to bring a topic back, you can always use the [Quote] function more effectively. You and I might already have had a conversation about the [Quote] function Smile.

I sometimes it difficult to read your responses to posts because you don't use the [Quote] function and as I have a slight visual impairment it's hard for me to distinguish your comments from the text you're commenting on. In fact, Mac. the way you do this does not meet accessibility standards that apply in this country and in the UK Smile.

So different things bother different people. Internet communication is much harder than face-to - face because we don't know people and we can't pick up visual cues.

But it is good to have an open discussion from time to time so that people have a chance to say things directly.


Last edited by Quiet on Sun Apr 08, 2012 7:44 pm; edited 1 time in total

Quiet


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Re: Why aren't more members posting?

Post by Quiet on Sun Apr 08, 2012 7:42 pm

Left Behind wrote:I agree with all you said, Quiet, with the exception that humour doesn't often come through in trance. I'm currecntly reading Arthur Findlay's Where Two World's Meet, and spirit is mentioned there as frequently trying to get the Circle members laughing. Indeed, they say that it helps them to establish contact.

You're dead right there, Jim Smile. I've read some of those accounts and they are definitely straightforward and one can see the humour which would have been more acute at the time.

The trance lectures I've heard directly have been singularly serious however. These have been largely occasional events. It would probably be different in a regular circle.

Quiet


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