Dangers of Spiritualism?

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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by MU!! on Fri Nov 30, 2012 6:07 pm

bravo321uk wrote:I am sorry Dig,, and this may sound blunt, but one of the biggest dangers to spiritualism is the fantasy that you have just posted about,,, I wish people wouldnt talk this stuff as it is simply not true,, Maybe a Read of myths and misconceptions of spiritualism will help you. For me I see the damage this kind of talk does,, I have to answer questions about it from people I meet,, some of them are genuinely scared.. and its because of this type of nonsense.. How is our beautiful religion meant to grow and florish when this kind of rubbish is still being spoken about?
Isn't it better to bring this junk talk out in the open, discuss the absurdity of it than to hope it is permanently swept under a rug, hidden and unresolved?


MU!!


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by MU!! on Fri Nov 30, 2012 6:20 pm

dig66 wrote:hi iam new but been a spiritualist since a was young , if theres no evil spirits then why do mediums ask protection from evil spirits and only ask for pure spirit ,bad spirits are those that were the same in the earthly body and carry on in spirit or ghosts ,when in a church these spirits can not enter as we are protected from them . spirits that are earth bound can not find the light to heaven , we as spiritualists can help them , ive done this a few times , there is good and evil both on the earth and in spirit , my girlfriend home as a few spirits that are earth bound , good and evil , the evil spirits are witchs , ive asked god and my guides for protection agaist these as they where trying to harm her , i expect those that have never encounted evil spirits use protection ie prayers ,amen

Shocked

I'll take a shot at one piece of this, the "moving on" of trapped ghosts.

I have several friends and associates who work in the paranormal. they come across these trapped ghosts all the time and have found several successful methods, and some unsuccessful ones, to get these ghosts to move up the dimensional ladder.

According to the spirits who have spoken on this, apparently those who are caught in this first, non-earthly realm are there of their own doing. Typically, they don't know they are dead and/or they refuse to give up materialism, maybe they have loved ones they want badly to support or they never believed in the afterlife to begin. The reasons are varied and the solutions to assisting them are as varied.

For more info, try Paul Eno @ beyondtheparanormal dot com

MU!!


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by Admin on Sat Dec 01, 2012 4:47 am

I am definitely in Bravo's camp on this one, however, I still ask for protection but not from evil Spirits, maybe mischievous ones. I would find that especially true in trance work. However, far to much would be trance is either the subconscious mind inadvertently or deliberately acting the communicator. In other cases it is caused by the mental state of the individual. Read back and you will find many suggestions that people with some mind states should not become involved in development.

It is no wonder that psychiatry and psychology grew up alongside the mediums. (William James, Myers, Jung just take a look at the history and remember the first documented cases of multiple personality were from both the UK and USA SPR)
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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by hiorta on Sun Dec 02, 2012 9:33 am

"those who are caught in this first, non-earthly realm are there of their own doing" MU!!

Aren't we all? Evolution of the Soul and all that?
Of course some are where they are by choice, too.

The 'Good & Evil' blanket condemnation so beloved by garrulous clergy misses the whole point of the evolutionary thing in that these are subjective, emotive terms, utterly meaningless in practical terms.
We all are both from other perspectives.


Last edited by hiorta on Mon Dec 03, 2012 11:02 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by LeroyC on Sun Dec 02, 2012 9:51 pm

Hi All,

For what its worth. I have been in Spiritualism for over 35 years. I have suffered the abuses of cranks, born again christians, dogmatic spiritualists, nutters, fake mediums, new agers, occultists, the lot.

I have toiled with the question of evil, and of good. I have soul searched, read, talked to clergy, with experienced Spitritualists, healers, psychics, the lot. I have witnessed about all there is to witness in Spiritualism, and read many of the great books and come to my own conclusions.

In the wonder of true survival evidence; of genuine mediumship and the love and dedication of well meaning Spiritualists and survivalists there are not problems. Its not spirit you need to worry about, its the sort of people who operate in this area ( and all other 'religions' I may add ) both the well meaning, but deluded individuals and downright nasty people.

The fundamental force in our survival and in our quest to prove it; and the fundamental focus of those in spirit is LOVE. Keep that at the centre of all you do, seek the best, and reject what you cannot accept and you will be fine.

All the best

LeroyC

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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by obiwan on Sun Dec 02, 2012 10:27 pm

Sounds very like silver Birch's philosophy too LeroyC Smile

obiwan


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by Admin on Sun Dec 02, 2012 10:51 pm

Very good points Leroy thanks for the post.

Jim
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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by LeroyC on Mon Dec 03, 2012 7:18 pm

Hi,

Thanks for those comments. Never been compared to Silver Birch before!!, but that is one set of books worth reading which might help with this thread. I must admit I have not read them through for years, but they should be on every Spiritualists booklist

Leroy C

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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by obiwan on Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:57 pm

Well I am a bit of a fan of Silver Birch's teachings as they strike me as very sensible, even as an agnostic non-spiritualist Very Happy

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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by mac on Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:07 am

obiwan wrote:Well I am a bit of a fan of Silver Birch's teachings as they strike me as very sensible, even as an agnostic non-spiritualist Very Happy

quack, quack.... Wink Very Happy

mac


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by obiwan on Tue Dec 04, 2012 10:42 am

Lol how you doing Mac?

obiwan


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by bravo321uk on Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:13 am

just some thoughts,,,
Admin fully agreed with what you have said in regard to trance work... gotta admit I dont really ask for protection as such... but then I always work with a heart felt prayer.. so probably have that base covered..
Leroy, I really like your comments and they really resonate with me,
Mu,, you talk about dealing with the misconceptions,,, but then you start to talk with one...
Ghosts and spirit are not the same thing,,, a ghost is residual energy,,, a left over imprint if you like... so your paranormal buddies that are moving these on... are not moving anything on to higher anything.. as a ghost has no consiouness... its why they repeat the same thing over and over...
I sometimes wonder why we as humans think we could do a better job with spirit than highly evolved spirit beings could... But then with ego being such a big driving force,,, it probably makes people feel good.. But at what cost?
well lets look at it a moment.... and lets change the word ghost to spirit.. as there are folks that claim to move spirit on too... have you noticed the type of spirit that is moved on,,,, is always really old... like a ww1 fighter pilot or something simular? no one ever says... ooo its johns gran,,, and johns grans is stuck.... lets move her on... why not? well wouldnt they have to provide evidence then that it is johns gran? but lets look at the effect this has... all the talk of these trapped or lost souls and such.. well as an example... I will use an imaginary person called wendy... and wendy has lost her father that she is greiving really badly for.. wendy in turns seeks out a spiritualist church... and whilst there heres all this chat of lost or trapped souls.. now lets step in wendys mind... she is grieving,,, she is at a really low point... and now... what if my dad is lost or trapped?
I hope you see my point... and im sorry if I come across as blunt


Last edited by bravo321uk on Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:27 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by mac on Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:24 am

obiwan wrote:Lol how you doing Mac?

I'm fine, thanks. Smile

mac


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by obiwan on Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:58 am

mac wrote:
obiwan wrote:Lol how you doing Mac?

I'm fine, thanks. Smile
Excellent.

obiwan


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by Admin on Tue Dec 04, 2012 10:59 pm

Well said Bravo my own thoughts of rescue mediumship echo yours and I agree with them.
However before I met up with Spiritualism I was aware of a man sitting in the corner of a room in a rented flat. Not sure he was stuck but I found out that this was the previous occupants favourite place to sit and look out at the trees indeed the owner of the flats recognised my description (did not even know what a medium was at the time). Disconcerting because it was now used as a bedroom. So not knowing what to do I put a built in wardrobe over the gap. When not there I opened the door so he could look out when home the door was closed. When I met Lis she had a "chat" with the man who decided maybe it was time he moved on but really had no one in Spirit to join, once the decision was made he never came back but went on happily.
Not really stuck but, for some reason, lacking awareness that it was time to move on. At some stage Spirit would have dealt with it I am sure, however, it was not urgent. Totally agree with your view on ghosts, its time people who want to comment on things really stopped to evaluate all the available material and looked at issues in great depth rather than grab reality from some of the light weight opinions expressed around the web.
We can only challenge the sceptics with real knowledge, a depth of understanding and a willingness to follow past leaders in Spiritualism to challenge the incompetent/misleading truths that are out there (including dealing with incompetent or fraudulent mediumship, healing and psychic work). After all over many years Spiritualists exposed more genuine fraud than the sceptics.
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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by MU!! on Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:10 am

obiwan wrote:
mac wrote:
obiwan wrote:Lol how you doing Mac?

I'm fine, thanks. Smile
Excellent.
mac did you enjoy your stay on Skeptiko?

quack quack. Very Happy Very Happy

MU!!


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by mac on Sat Dec 08, 2012 3:52 am

Just for the record there's a member on Skeptico who has the same username as I use here (and elsewhere on other forums) the same username I've had since I began writing in 2003.

By great coincidence (?) the member on Skeptico became a member there only recently.

On another of my regular websites MU has recently been banned by the moderator for referring to myself, and to certain other members, in apparently deliberately-misleading ways.

Certain of those members view the appearance of this similarly named new member on Skeptico as highly suspicious rather than coincidental.

I apologise to members here for raising this matter on the forum boards here but the mocking tone of MU suggests there's more to his recent appearance and his postings than there appears to be.

mac


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by MU!! on Sat Dec 08, 2012 4:10 am

I am sorry if I upset you mac. My apologies. Any more claims that you might have with evidence of them would be truly appreciated.

MU!!


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by Wes on Sat Dec 08, 2012 4:27 am

Please be reminded of the forum rules and etiquette, to be found at:

http://www.spiritualismlink.com/t1805-forum-etiquette-and-rules

which says, among other things:

Members posting on any thread or topic are expected to act in a courteous, polite and respectful manner towards other members posts.

On occasion, members may hold very different viewpoints, however, there is no excuse for personal insults, attacks or other forms of hostility in any debate, and such misconduct will incur censure. If offending is repeated, the member or members will receive a formal warning in the form of a Yellow Card and a private message will be sent to them by the Administrators notifying the member or members that their conduct breeches the forum rules and etiquette requirements.

Any member who persists in inappropriate comments in their posts, despite notifications from the Administrators to desist, may receive a Red Card and risk having their membership removed and/ or their being banned from the forum for a specified period of time or permanently if the breech of the rules and requirements is of a serious or extreme nature.

Any member who believes they have observed inappropriate comments, or who feels that they have been the target of hostility or improper personal attack, are expected to notify the Administrators by private message and not to retaliate in kind on the forum. The Administrators will then take up the complaint and strive to find an appropriate resolution of the problem.
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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by Admin on Sat Dec 08, 2012 5:34 am

Thanks Wes, MU I am not happy with the process you are following here and am unsure of its purpose. Are you here to gather knowledge which you can use elsewhere, share any genuine information you may have about Spiritualism of for another reason? I have known Mac for a long time and if he says he is not on Skeptiko then I will totally accept his word. Certainly one good look was enough to convince me that I already had enough on my plate to not get into debates on that forum
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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by hiorta on Sat Dec 08, 2012 8:10 am

Spiritualism is simply recognising that all Life cannot die and that change is the natural order. The implications of this Truth are endless, however.

In effect, the entire outcome of the individual's life(s) and their way forward is and remains in their own hands. They alone are their own saviour - the responsibility for their Life lies securely in their own hands.
Absolutely just and fitting, is it not?
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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by mac on Sat Dec 08, 2012 9:17 am

MU!! wrote:I am sorry if I upset you mac. My apologies. Any more claims that you might have with evidence of them would be truly appreciated.

I don't want an apology and for evidence of what I've said try these...

posting #318 et al http://forum.mind-energy.net/skeptiko-podcast/4475-physical-mediumship-32.html

post no 53 http://physicalmediumship.forumotion.com/t900p45-new

I'm making no claims about what's going on in Skeptico, or about your own approach, but it's curious to say the least that a recent new member just happens to have the same username as the one I've used since around 2003.

mac


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by MU!! on Sun Dec 09, 2012 7:37 am

hiorta wrote:Spiritualism is simply recognising that all Life cannot die and that change is the natural order. The implications of this Truth are endless, however.
Do you speak of spiritualism or Spiritualism?

MU!!


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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by Admin on Sun Dec 09, 2012 7:44 am

Mu clearly as this is a Spiritualist forum devoted to Modern Spiritualism and Mac is a fellow Spiritualist it is Spiritualism.
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Re: Dangers of Spiritualism?

Post by mac on Sun Dec 09, 2012 10:03 am

MU!! You asked for "....Any more claims that you might have with evidence of them.

I've responded (in a posting higher above) to you request but you haven't acknowledged what I wrote.

Did you not see my response? What's your response now I've pointed it out to you?

mac


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