psychic cf. medium

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psychic cf. medium

Post by mac on Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:01 am

I intend to put together a small piece which looks at the differences between psychics and mediums, between psychic activities and mediumship. I'd also like to bring in channelling and the role of helpers, teachers and guides.

I'd appreciate hearing from members on any of the above so I can get clear how these issues are seen from a Spiritualist perspective.

thanks in anticipation

mac


Last edited by mac on Sun Sep 13, 2009 1:06 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: psychic cf. medium

Post by Admin on Sat Sep 12, 2009 1:23 am

Hi Mac,

This si an interesting piece which has relavance for you I think it came from this blog http://autumnforestghosthunter.blogspot.com/2009/09/cold-readings-is-your-psychic-mentalist.html

Thursday, September 10, 2009
"Cold Readings: Is Your Psychic a Mentalist?

According to Wikipedia, a cold reading is “a series of techniques used by mentalists, illusionists, fortune tellers, psychics, and mediums to determine or express details about another person, often in order to convince them that the reader knows much more about a subject than they actually do. Without prior knowledge of a person, a practiced cold reader can still quickly obtain a great deal of information about the subject by analyzing the person's body language, age, clothing or fashion, hairstyle, gender, sexual orientation, religion, race or ethnicity, level of education, manner of speech, place of origin, etc. Cold readers commonly employ high probability guesses about the subject, quickly picking up on signals from their subjects as to whether their guesses are in the right direction or not, and then emphasizing and reinforcing any chance connections the subjects acknowledge while quickly moving on from missed guesses.”

Techniques to watch for (you’ve easily seen TV psychics use these a lot):

“Shotgunning” (Wikipedia) “A commonly-used cold reading technique used, among others, by television psychics and spiritual mediums. The psychic or reader slowly offers a huge quantity of very general information, often to an entire audience (some of which is very likely to be correct, near correct or at the very least, provocative or evocative to someone present), observes their subjects' reactions (especially their body language), and then narrows the scope, acknowledging particular people or concepts and refining the original statements according to those reactions to promote an emotional response.”

Example: "I sense an older male figure in your life, who wants you to know whilst you may have had disagreements in your life, he still loved you."

“Barnum Statements” (Wikipedia) “named after P.T. Barnum, the American showman) are statements that seem personal, yet apply to many people. And while seemingly specific, such statements are often open-ended or give the reader the maximum amount of "wiggle room" in a reading. They are designed to elicit identifying responses from people. The statements can then be developed into longer and more sophisticated paragraphs and seem to reveal great amounts of detail about a person. The effect relies in part on the eagerness of people to fill in details and make connections between what is said and some aspect of their own lives (often searching their entire life's history to find some connection, or reinterpreting the statement in any number of different possible ways so as to make it apply to themselves). A talented and charismatic reader can sometimes even bully a subject into admitting a connection, demanding over and over that they acknowledge a particular statement as having some relevance and maintaining that they just aren't thinking hard enough, or are repressing some important memory.”

Example: "You had an accident when you were a child involving water.”

“The Rainbow Ruse” (Wikipedia) “The rainbow ruse is a crafted statement which simultaneously awards the subject with a specific personality trait, as well as the opposite of that trait. With such a phrase, a cold reader can "cover all possibilities" and appear to have made an accurate deduction in the mind of the subject, despite the fact that a rainbow ruse statement is vague and contradictory. This technique is used since personality traits are not quantifiable, and also because nearly everybody has experienced both sides of a particular emotion at some time in their lives.”

Example: "I would say that you are mostly shy and quiet, but when the mood strikes you, you can easily become the center of attention."

Perspective: One time, a friend begged me to get a reading after she got one. I humored her. I wasn’t expecting anything extraordinary. Their wasn’t a psychic sensation in the whole shop. I sat down and the woman took my hand and tried the shock factor. “You’re not at fault! You must stop feeling so guilty!” A brilliant technique to make me rush through my mind for anything I might feel guilty about. I gave her credit for technique. Like a good fly fisherman, she cast her line and could have hooked a sucker. Luckily, I expected her to play this game. I not only had no feelings of guilt in my consciousness, but as she spoke, she told me I should consider leaving my boyfriend, he’ll never marry me. (I was married). She proceeded to tell me to repaint the room I painted red (no red in my house-I hate the color). I finally just got up and left while she was in mid sentence. A less savvy person might have replaced "boyfriend" with "husband," and considered "I once thought about painting my room red," anything to make it "fit."

This is not to say psychics don’t exist. I know for a fact that they do, as I myself have skills that I can neither explain or often times control. When you get a reading from a psychic, you need to ask yourself “how specific is this to me, or is it a broad statement that fits many?” “Are they waiting too much for me to respond and lead them in the right direction?” “Is this the kind of thing I might hear from a counselor and advisor?”

Someone tapping into you psychically should be able to give you extraordinary details about your life, odd facts that would not be commonly guessed by anyone. They shouldn’t be asking you to make decisions based on their findings, have you pour your heart out to them so that they know too much of your personal lives and therefore can lead you into thinking they know you so well, or request that you come back again and again.

I’ll be brutally honest. Anyone making money as a psychic may not have your best interests in mind. It’s a business. One in which you coming back is critically important, just like your counselor or psychiatrist. Your dependence on them assures their income. We don’t have any regulations on psychics, no testing, certification, or a board of examiners like medical professionals have. As a consumer, you need to be educated, suspicious, and cautious. When you go forth to use a psychic and shell out money, consider it purely entertainment."
The individual goes on to say
"September 10, 2009 7:56 PM
Autumnforest said...
Yeah. Psychics do exist. I hope people realize the role of a psychic. They shouldn't be advising you and they shouldn't be baiting you to come back. If a person gets into the relationship knowing it's a form of counseling, it can be beneficial. Some people aren't comfortable talking to ministers and psychologists. Just so long as they understand that the psychic aspects should not be the focus of the relationship but something that might enhance the ability to be empathetic. A perfect counselor doesn't tell you what to do, but guides you so you see the answer yourself. Hope that helps folks. I've seen people become quite dependent on psychics and there's no way to certify these people have any real talents other than some good tricks and a great listening ear."

Very valid points and ones I try and get people to understand
1 Is the reading really psychic or basically as she suggests telling you what to do and implying depenedence.
2 If its psychic just because the reader keeps saying "they are telling me" it does not prove they have a Spirit connection. Indeed assume for your own safety that they do not and treat the information as not from a divine source it will help you be discerning.
3 if they claim they have a loved one did they quickly prove it with accurate information not wheedled out of you in some way again be discerning
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Re: psychic cf. medium

Post by mac on Sun Sep 13, 2009 12:55 am

thanks Jim. I'm wondering about the following paragraph, though:

"Someone tapping into you psychically should be able to give you extraordinary details about your life, odd facts that would not be commonly guessed by anyone."

I see this as the main difference between psychic and medium. I would expect a psychic to do what's suggested in the first sentence but I don't see what value there is in doing that. Why is it that a psychic, quote: "...should be able (my underlining) to give you extraordinary details about your life"? Why should they? To what end? For entertainment? OK, fair enough. Anything else?

Provided that folks understand that the psychic they're sitting with is going to do a psychic reading of them and makes it clear that they do not have a spiritual link (in the way a medium should) then I'd have no objection - you get what you pay for.

Quite what the psychic could usefully do for their sitter(s) with the information gleaned that way I'd be interested to learn as I admit my ignorance. Counselling perhaps? Yeah, right, like a psychic fair practitioner should be trusted to counsel someone they've just met, or even met repeatedly... Rolling Eyes

Now, just possibly, a psychic might 'see' that their sitter has an emotional problem which might be helped by a mediumistic reading. So that psychic might then don a different hat and use their attributes as a medium to give their sitter evidence of the survival of a loved one who has passed.

I expect that there are individuals who can, and indeed might, do just that. And provided that all is made clear to the sitter(s) as the change occurs, then I can see great potential value.

How many times does that happen I wonder Exclamation

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Re: psychic cf. medium

Post by mac on Sun Sep 13, 2009 1:16 am

"“Shotgunning” (Wikipedia) “A commonly-used cold reading technique used, among others, by television psychics and spiritual mediums."

.....by television psychics and spiritual mediums Now this is really sad Sad

Perhaps the only consolation is that the words 'Spiritualist mediums' were not used instead of spiritual mediums - although I doubt that any difference was intended! Rolling Eyes

As a matter of curiosity, do non-Spiritualist (or spiritist) mediums tell the same story of survival, do they provide much the same evidence of survival etc?

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Re: psychic cf. medium

Post by Admin on Sun Sep 13, 2009 1:36 am

Quite what the psychic could usefully do for their sitter(s) with the information gleaned that way I'd be interested to learn as I admit my ignorance. Counselling perhaps? Yeah, right, like a psychic fair practitioner should be trusted to counsel someone they've just met, or even met repeatedly...

Now, just possibly, a psychic might 'see' that their sitter has an emotional problem which might be helped by a mediumistic reading. So that psychic might then don a different hat and use their attributes as a medium to give their sitter evidence of the survival of a loved one who has passed.

This is one issue that worries me greatly too many people never learn anything about the process and the moral/ethical issues involved. They start off and discover they can do some psychic work that people seem to like and go on. At times they become convinced that this comes from "Spirit" and they listen to those who say give what you get regardless. The resultant damage can do untold harm to the individual receiving the reading.

Very few who go to get a reading understand anything about the process either, so are unaware of how the "message" is being obtained (readers own mind, psychic pick up or Mediumship which of course should be real proof of survival). Some go for fun, others in lieu of proper counselling and others to get their fortune told. Talking to a phone line psychic around 80% of readings are about love lives about 5% about the loss of loved ones.

If neither the reader nor the message recipient have the slightest idea of the process or message source we start with a huge and potentially dangerous problem. In honesty I really believe a certification process should be mandatory before you can be let loose to make money from the unsuspecting public. Psychics are messing with peoples heads much in the way of counsellors but without any training. Clearly if they do, with no counselling qualification, move into a counselling role they could be prosecuted if pursued by the authorities but it is a long bow to draw.

Then if both parties to a reading have a mutual understanding of what will achieved then the reading may have value. Hmm I wonder should all private readers go through training in counselling?
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Re: psychic cf. medium

Post by Admin on Sun Sep 13, 2009 1:46 am

Perhaps the only consolation is that the words 'Spiritualist mediums' were not used instead of spiritual mediums - although I doubt that any difference was intended!

As a matter of curiosity, do non-Spiritualist (or spiritist) mediums tell the same story of survival, do they provide much the same evidence of survival etc?

Like you I doubt any difference was intended, hmm I suspect some Spiritualist or Spiritist "Mediums" these days do not do proper proof of survival. Therefore to know whether non spiritualist Mediums do provide evidence of survival is difficult, I guess some do, certainly I expect John Edwards clients believe he is a Medium proving survival.

Then, additionally a private reading can be, to borrow from Forrest Gump, "Like a box of chocolates" a bit of psychic pick up and a bit of survival work. As long as the reader knows what they are doing and says where they are getting the information I do not have a major problem with this. Indeed when you are sitting opposite someone and even, like Gordon Smith sometimes take their hand before starting for attunement I suspect the dividing line is bound to become more blurred than in a public demonstration. Once again it gets back to the rigour of the training and the understanding of the reader about the actual processes involved so they can differentiate the source of the material.


Good points Mac

Cheers

Jim
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Re: psychic cf. medium

Post by mac on Sun Sep 13, 2009 1:49 am

"Hmm I wonder should all private readers go through training in counselling?"

Maybe they should but I see little prospect of that.... But does psychic reading really need to happen if it's counselling we're talking about? Maybe it's an uncertain, potentially dangerous, mix to use deliberately?

Regular counselling techniques would - I'd think - have as much effectiveness and have been developed and tested. I doubt there's many professionally-trained practitioners who would use, or admit to using, psychic reading of their clients/patients.

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Re: psychic cf. medium

Post by Admin on Sun Sep 13, 2009 2:05 am

It is interesting however Mac how many counsellors do attend psychic development groups and how many of those developing also take up counselling training. Whenever Lis runs a healing course there are often qualified nurses attending too.

Now in action they may not admit to using the skills but if you ask them they do by exploiting all aspects of their potential.

I think a large proportion of people seeking readings would probably not have them if they did not believe there was some magical mysterious ability the reader had. Others go along in lieu of counselling which they are either in denial of needing or unable to obtain. Some really want to hear an outside party tell them what they have already decided to do.

Of course sometimes what they get can startle them so much they belive it is magical. I was doing a reading at a fund raiser (the only readings I have ever done), The lady sat down and I immediately said I think you should go to see someone else because I am a proof of survival medium and cannot help you with the question you want answering should you leave your husband. In fact the very fact I knew her question without her speaking meant she stayed to meet her loved ones. Then she went elsewhere to be told about her marriage.

Many have no idea how a reader can "know" what they do so it does lead them to be more than a little vulnerable.
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Re: psychic cf. medium

Post by mac on Sun Sep 13, 2009 2:24 am

Admin wrote:It is interesting however Mac how many counsellors do attend psychic development groups and how many of those developing also take up counselling training. Whenever Lis runs a healing course there are often qualified nurses attending too.

Now in action they may not admit to using the skills but if you ask them they do by exploiting all aspects of their potential.

I think a large proportion of people seeking readings would probably not have them if they did not believe there was some magical mysterious ability the reader had. Others go along in lieu of counselling which they are either in denial of needing or unable to obtain. Some really want to hear an outside party tell them what they have already decided to do.

Of course sometimes what they get can startle them so much they belive it is magical. I was doing a reading at a fund raiser (the only readings I have ever done), The lady sat down and I immediately said I think you should go to see someone else because I am a proof of survival medium and cannot help you with the question you want answering should you leave your husband. In fact the very fact I knew her question without her speaking meant she stayed to meet her loved ones. Then she went elsewhere to be told about her marriage.

Many have no idea how a reader can "know" what they do so it does lead them to be more than a little vulnerable.

That's interesting, Jim - I wouldn't have thought it but if it helps them in their role, all power to their elbow. I can understand how nurses might also be interested in healing. I suspect many have also seen the departure of their patients but don't speak of it openly. Wink

I think you've hit the nail squarely on the head when you mention "magical" - I suspect that many psychics are happy to be thought of having such powers! Vulnerability, too, is so easy to exploit by those so minded.

Nice story about the lady who came for one reason and stayed for another Smile

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Re: psychic cf. medium

Post by Admin on Sun Sep 13, 2009 3:01 am

Hi Mac

Yes its nice when it works like that you remember to trust the pick up and give it out like that. The times doing mediumship I do not go with something to realise I was stupid not to. Like two weeks ago with teh developing group of Mediums I picked one up and knew who's it was and didn't take the chance would have hellped because I had her Grand Mother there.

Oh well its why we keep trying to improve isn't it. Smile
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