a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

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a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by mac on Mon Jan 05, 2015 3:49 pm

For those who don't follow events on PM4U:  The dream goes on despite the failure of the Scole project to achieve what was promised.  Deluded or self-deluded? Next time it might be BIG BUCKS down the pan.


Hi Everybody,
Prior to our visit and formal viewing last Wednesday the 12th November of the proposed Centre which can be identified as the one mentioned in my blog: Scole - the Final Project, I promised to send out a report to a number of my friends about the special property which is currently for sale in the Antequera area of Andalucía, Spain. This exact property has been indicated to us by Spirit for the last 7 years as the place they want Sandra and me to acquire as a specialist Centre for the study; development and demonstration (as well as education to the public about) physical mediumship and its phenomena. I am now doing that in a blog for all my friends (Members of PM4U) to see.

It would also serve as the International Headquarters of 'The Spiritual Science Foundation' - a non-profit organisation that we are actually in the process of registering formally in Spain at this very moment. The asking price for the property is €300,000 euros, but there is still room for negotiation on that price, and we feel that it could possibly sink as low as €250,000 euros as the current owner (a lady who is over 90 years old) is fairly desperate to sell.

With the total amount of land involved along with this property being no less than a generous 25,700 square metres; the main (Centre) building is extremely large (a total of 460+ square metres within the building). There are two barns on the property (a very large one that has housed goats, and a smaller one that is perfect for conversion to a small gite and dedicated séance room). The actual main building is an ex Bar/Restaurant that has failed as a business at least twice in the last 4 years. I can confirm that the current asking price is indeed rock bottom and represents a superb bargain in real estate. Definitely a solid investment for a potential 'Patron' or a 'Canny Company Investor' as - in the next 5-10 years (and with a lot of work and much Tender Loving Care from us) it is almost certain to more than double in value.

Our first formal viewing of the property last Wednesday (after driving over 260 miles and staying overnight in a hotel) was quite difficult as we had expected to be met by the owner's granddaughter and - in fact - it was the owner herself - a very formidable old lady in her 90's - who came instead. She was accompanied by a young man who might even have been a great grandson. Neither, regrettably, spoke any English (whilst we knew the granddaughter spoke a little), and the old lady wanted to rush us round the property whilst smothering us with a rapid Spanish commentary in a regional accent not known to us at all before (as she imagined) taking the money for the property sale from us in cash there and then!!!! Unfortunately, therefore, our first formal viewing was not quite as long or as thorough as we would have liked. We were there just 30 minutes.
However, that was long enough for us to get a pretty good idea of everything that was involved with regard to the property. I am attaching 4 rough schematic diagrams (I have drawn) of the upstairs; downstairs; potential gite & séance room (now a storage barn), and the whole site of 25,700 square metres. None of these are to scale, but they will give you a pretty good idea of the setup of the land and buildings.

Part of the Car Park at the front of the property had been recently re-surfaced with tarmac. Since all the land in front of the property was included in the sale up to the road, we estimated that the car park would hold anything up to 80 vehicles at any one time. There are gates to the left of the property where the drive at the side of the main building allows access to any lorry or car wanting to reach as far as the first barn (which currently has a garage door at the front). To the right, there is an archway with gate that gives pedestrian access to the Bar/Restaurant and to a side terrace which was used for further customers' tables whilst the restaurant was operating.

On that right side also was a French-window style access into the Grand Salon/Restaurant, and a second door a little further on along the right also gave access to the rear of the restaurant. There was a third door towards the back of the building on the right side which gave access directly to the stairs leading to the first floor accommodation.

The terraces to the left and right sides and the very large terrace at the back of the building were laid with stone slabs, but all these were totally overgrown with weeds, and several strong applications of weedkiller would be necessary all round to put that right. Walking around the building however, gave the impression (that would need to be verified by a good surveyor) that the building (which is quite old - we did not manage to date it accurately owing to difficulty of communication at this stage) is very solid, and does not need any major restoration - just cosmetic alterations for the time being.

Inside, the Grand Salon (or Hall) was fairly neat and tidy. There was a Bar right across the back of the room (the site of which had been changed since our first visit to the Restaurant where we ate a meal 7 years ago). We did feel that before it could be used as a Centre, the room would need a total redecoration, as the walls are currently painted in a dark red colour. The ex restaurant tables and chairs were stacked in this hall and would - we understood - be included in the sale. Off the Hall was a men's toilet with two stalls and two urinals (in very good tiled condition); a ladies toilet with three stalls (in a very good tiled condition) and a storage room about the same size as one of the toilets which (we believed) had been used as a storage facility for bar stock. This was also in a good condition.

There is access from the rear of the hall to the commercial kitchen, which is large, and contains two very large but ancient commercial ovens which seemed very dirty, and would not be suitable for us to use today. These had operated on bottle gas, and there is a small storage cupboard outside for the large cylinders. There were however a few good stainless steel catering tables that remain, and which would be useful.
There is mains electric to the property, and a landline telephone, but we ascertained that the water currently comes from a nearby spring. We have been aware of the spring ourselves and the river that leads from it for 7 years, as it is mentioned in all the tourist literature. The water is quite pure and filters through the 'Torcal' mountain very close by (the property is in the lee of the 'Torcal' itself). We believe (and would need to confirm when the premises is visited by a surveyor) that the sewage is connected to a septic tank.

A rear double door leads out of the commercial kitchen into (on the right hand side) what was the servery for drinks and barbeques on the rear terrace of the property with half moon window openings - as can be seen in two of the enclosed pictures, and (on the left) a utility room. Both the servery and the utility room were in a mess with junk all over the floor, and would need to be cleaned up, but the structure in both cases appeared to be sound.

We were taken up the stairs to see the accommodation on the first floor. That was generally in very good condition, and the rooms would immediately be habitable after a lick of paint all round. One of the rear double bedrooms immediately at the top of the stairs was being used as a dining room, and French doors led from this room out onto the tiled sun terrace which was over the top of the servery and utility room.

All of the rooms led off a central corridor which was neat, and tiled throughout. (See the attachments for the exact room layout and schematic) There were two small domestic kitchenettes/galleys which (in our opinion) needed to be knocked through into one larger domestic kitchen. Two of the bedrooms were single bedrooms, but all the others were large and excellent in size and condition. The two bathrooms were adequate; each had a bath but no current shower. Looking from the front of the property, the master bedroom was on the left (overlooking the hills and the property's olive grove to the side, and the road at the front. The salon/living room was large and airy. Also at the front but to the right (overlooking a farmer's fields to the side, and the road at the front.

We managed to get access to the smallest of the two barns, which was to the left of - and behind - the rear terrace of the property. It was a little disappointing to discover that all the interior walls were rough (breeze-block type) and needed plastering but - nevertheless - the property would easily convert into a small gite, despite the fact that internal walls, adequate flooring and a false roof needed to be added. At the front of this building, there is a storage garage with a garage door, which - without too much trouble - could rapidly be turned into a dedicated séance room. This would need a rear door adding to the back wall of this room, and the current window and garage door need to be bricked up. Like the rest of this barn, all the walls would need plastering and a ceiling needs to be added.

On a positive note, there had been a sizeable kitchen garden to the right hand side of this small barn. Whilst covered in weeds, I could see that the soil in this raised kitchen garden was rich and would (after lots of digging and raking) produce some good vegetables. At the back of this kitchen garden area was a mesh enclosure which looked as though it might have been used for keeping chickens in the past.

Beyond the small barn was a fence and gate behind which was a large rear garden, somewhat overgrown, and stocked mainly with almond trees. At the very end of the garden was - we could see - a large barn, and we were told that this had housed goats in the past. Unfortunately, we could not get access to the bottom part of the garden because the gate was locked with a chain and padlock and we were told that the owner had lost the key to the padlock!!! On the next viewing, I think we will need to go equipped with bolt cutters!!!

We did not have the opportunity to walk the full boundary of the property this time - as I wanted to do - but this is something that we would insist on the next time we visit. I am attaching the 4 schematic drawings I did of the premises, plus some pictures of the property.

I look forward to receiving members' comments on the property!!
Robin

mac


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by Slatewriter on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:29 pm

So do you think R&S are wasting their time then Mac ?

Slatewriter


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by mac on Mon Jan 05, 2015 9:55 pm

We'll see....  You've seen the proposals, there are photos and more details are on the PM4U website. It's known that it will cost a whole lot of money. What do you think?

mac


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by Jane Lyzell on Mon Jan 05, 2015 11:37 pm

What is this meen - that he is asking members for mony ?
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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by mac on Tue Jan 06, 2015 12:34 am

Jane Lyzell wrote:What is this meen - that he is asking members for mony ?

He's opened an account into which any individual or any organisation can make a contribution. I think corporate sponsorship/ownership is what's hoped for because of the large monetary amounts that will be needed.

mac


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by Admin on Tue Jan 06, 2015 2:28 am

Hmm having got this money who (or whom) become the owners a center for the cult of New Age Spiritualism and D'Lite worship with Kai as one of the priests?

Subsequently I thought I would follow Macs subsequent thoughts and add a suitable leg pull emoticon, given this is physical mediumship I thought John King and his band of Kings would do fine, I am sure give them time they would appear (in the dark?) Pirate Pirate Crew


Last edited by Admin on Tue Jan 06, 2015 4:01 am; edited 2 times in total
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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by mac on Tue Jan 06, 2015 3:55 am

Admin wrote:Hmm having got this money who (or whom) become the owners a center for the cult of New Age Spiritualism and D'Lite worship with Kai as one of the priests?

Should you have added some kind of emoticon at the end, Jim, so that Robin would realise it was only a leg-pull? (like so Razz Laughing Wink )

I suppose a lot of legal stuff will have to be nailed when - if - there's enough money promised by a large sponsor or even a multitude of private donors. I'll be surprised if it happens but who knows? Mr Foy declared that 'spirit' has had eyes on that place (whether that's metaphorically or literally I don't know) for seven years so, again, who knows? Maybe 'spirit' will also provide the wherewithal to buy the property and fund its running costs until it's fully established and self sustaining. Maybe the wealthy, internationally acclaimed phenomenalists on PM4U will help by using some of their income for the venture?

Lots of maybes and lots to keep us watching...

mac


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by Admin on Tue Jan 06, 2015 3:59 am

I took your advice Mac and edited the post.
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Admin
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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by mac on Tue Jan 06, 2015 5:19 am

Admin wrote:I took your advice Mac and edited the post.

There ya go!  Wouldn't want anyone getting upset now, would we...? It certainly gave me a chuckle! Laughing Wink

mac


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by Neilos on Tue Jan 06, 2015 10:17 am

It will hardly be a centre of excellence based on the antics we see on PM4U Rolling Eyes

Neilos


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by Jane Lyzell on Tue Jan 06, 2015 11:30 am

mac wrote:
Jane Lyzell wrote:What is this meen - that he is asking members for mony ?

He's opened an account into which any individual or any organisation can make a contribution.  I think corporate sponsorship/ownership is what's hoped for because of the large monetary amounts that will be needed.
o my god Evil or Very Mad
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Jane Lyzell


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by obiwan on Tue Jan 06, 2015 11:59 am

Dream on....

obiwan


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by mac on Tue Jan 06, 2015 3:01 pm

obiwan wrote:Dream on....

I fancy you might be bang on there my duck friend. Like the Scole venture except with the potential to be far more expensive. Crying or Very sad A

mac


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by mac on Tue Jan 06, 2015 3:02 pm

Neilos wrote:It will hardly be a centre of excellence based on the antics we see on PM4U Rolling Eyes

Yes I agree with that.

mac


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by obiwan on Tue Jan 06, 2015 4:35 pm

mac wrote:
obiwan wrote:Dream on....

I fancy you might be bang on there my duck friend.  Like the Scole venture except with the potential to be far more expensive. Crying or Very sad A

Lol for some Mac😄
I am living proof that a fool and his money are easily parted.

obiwan


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by Lis on Tue Jan 06, 2015 10:49 pm

If I understand what Robin Foy has posted, the intent is to set up "a non-profit organisation" and for the proposed building to operate as the "International Headquarters of 'The Spiritual Science Foundation.'"

Now a not for profit organisation, if set up as a legal entity and designed to operate for the benefit of its members could purchase the property and operate it as a venue for physical mediumship. Of course, by definition non-profit means that no member, and certainly no member of the executive - that is committee member - president of the foundation - etc., could personally benefit financially from the venture. Profits from activities must be returned to the organisation and used for the purposes of maintaining the property or activities or for furthering the activities.

We must ask, in the setting up of this proposed organisation who will be regarded as the "public officer" - presumably Foy, and who would be its members?

The difficulty I see with this proposed scheme is that Foy is seeking "donations" from individuals and potentially from a major "sponsor" none of whom would, unless the said proposed organisation offers membership in return for donations, be entitled to have any say whatsoever in the running of the organisation.

In principle I do not object to Robin Foy's desire to create an organisation to support and promote physical mediumship, or to purchase premises in which those activities can be held. It is clear however that he has not, at this stage at least, made clear how this "Spiritual Science Foundation" would operate, who would be its members, under what conditions "donations" would be received, how those "donations" would be used, and by whom.

It is clear that while Robin Foy believes that this proposed venture is spirit driven he is not willing to put his own money in to buy the property and without many donations and/or a major sponsor in the very near future, his hopes of purchasing this property in the Antequera area of Andalucía, Spain, (which is, I believe, some two hundred miles from where the Foy's currently reside), is decidedly slim.

A secondary problem, but one that is nevertheless significant is, of course, just who would be the physical mediums that Foy would invite to work at this foundation. It seems certain from the way he approaches things on his forum that guest mediums would almost certainly include Warren Caylor, Kai Muegge and the Mont Cabriol men. All of whom have had serious doubts raised about the legitimacy of their activities.

I feel confident in saying that I doubt mediums such as Scott Milligan (despite his withdrawal from the AFC) or David Thompson would be willing to work anywhere the above named mediums are welcomed. If that is the case, then Foy could find himself playing host only to 'mediums' those reputations are questioned, and God forbid, should any one of them be caught out in fraud, Foy's dream (if ever realised in the first place) would go down the gurgler very fast.

Lis
Admin


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by mac on Wed Jan 07, 2015 1:32 am

hence the thread's title - grand or grandiose?  

It's hard to take the the proposed venture seriously given the bizarre end of the New Spiritual Science Foundation (aka 'Scole'), its activities apparently terminated by a cosmic master because of the impact of those activities on the activities of a group operating in the future.  

I would shake my head in disbelief if I hadn't lived through those years and been a close observer....

mac


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by Admin on Wed Jan 07, 2015 2:56 am

Maybe the Cosmic Master Planted some wormholes in selected brains before becoming an ascended cosmic master Mac alienbeam

Seriously whatever the initial events in the Scole, with an almost "normal" ambition, and the then "research" findings, the ending was bizarre to say the least and probably ensures his support for Kai
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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by mac on Wed Jan 07, 2015 4:52 am

Admin wrote:Maybe the Cosmic Master Planted some wormholes in selected brains before becoming an ascended cosmic master Mac alienbeam

Seriously whatever the initial events in the Scole, with an almost "normal" ambition, and the then "research" findings, the ending was bizarre to say the least and probably ensures his support for Kai

Where did you get that emoticon, Jim?!!  Laughing   As Frank Carson used to say "It's a cracker!".  And seriously in response, I was an out-and-out supporter of what I believed to be the laudable aims of the NSSF right up to the report of unseen aliens in the seance room and the eventual grand pronouncements about why the Scole Experiment had been terminated by those cosmic monitors overseeing events in our dimension, ready to pull the plug.  It left me frustrated and (almost) lost for words when I read and then re-read the report in 'The Spiritual Scientist'.  

I have no idea how many supported the Foundation and how many of them felt as I did.  I have no idea if any of them still support their former leader but I rarely read anything to suggest that many/any are still around and following developments.  Perhaps, though, they've been sworn to secrecy and I was rejected for expressing my views at the time - that's kinda what's seen on PM4U nowadays.  

I think back sometimes on those times and think what a sucker I was....


Last edited by mac on Thu Jan 08, 2015 4:32 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : corrected to "It's a cracker" - badly edited beforre!)

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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by obiwan on Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:32 am

mac wrote:
Admin wrote:Maybe the Cosmic Master Planted some wormholes in selected brains before becoming an ascended cosmic master Mac alienbeam

Seriously whatever the initial events in the Scole, with an almost "normal" ambition, and the then "research" findings, the ending was bizarre to say the least and probably ensures his support for Kai

Where did you get that emoticon, Jim?!!  Laughing   As Frank Carson used to say "It  Now I's a cracker!".  And seriously in response, I was an out-and-out supporter of what I believed to be the laudable aims of the NSSF right up to the report of unseen aliens in the seance room and the eventual grand pronouncements about why the Scole Experiment had been terminated by those cosmic monitors overseeing events in our dimension, ready to pull the plug.  It left me frustrated and (almost) lost for words when I read and then re-read the report in 'The Spiritual Scientist'.  

I have no idea how many supported the Foundation and how many of them felt as I did.  I have no idea if any of them still support their former leader but I rarely read anything to suggest that many/any are still around and following developments.  Perhaps, though, they've been sworn to secrecy and I was rejected for expressing my views at the time - that's kinda what's seen on PM4U nowadays.  

I think back sometimes on those times and think what a sucker I was....

There's no shame in trusting people initially.

obiwan


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by mac on Wed Jan 07, 2015 2:53 pm

I'm someone who does trust others to be upfront and honest but on too many occasions that trust has been misplaced and those occasions have left me wondering if I am (as sometimes mockingly accused) foolish to expect honesty.

mac


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by Neilos on Wed Jan 07, 2015 2:57 pm

Loyalty and trust are important qualities to most of us, but unfortunately those qualities can be exploited by some.

Neilos


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by obiwan on Wed Jan 07, 2015 3:15 pm

mac wrote:I'm someone who does trust others to be upfront and honest but on too many occasions that trust has been misplaced and those occasions have left me wondering if I am (as sometimes mockingly accused) foolish to expect honesty.

Innocent as a lamb but wily as a serpent. I'd say it depends what's at stake 😄

obiwan


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by obiwan on Wed Jan 07, 2015 3:16 pm

Neilos wrote:Loyalty and trust are important qualities to most of us, but unfortunately those qualities can be exploited by some.

They are beautiful qualities. Honi soit qui mal y pense 😄

obiwan


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Re: a grand - or grandiose? - vision?

Post by Admin on Thu Jan 08, 2015 12:19 am

obiwan wrote: There's no shame in trusting people initially.

Indeed Obi, the initial work on the Scole appeared quite normal, even if it was trying to approach physical mediumship in a different way. It was that which was investigated. I feel fairly sure that the latter events would never have received any positive feedback from the researchers. The big issue is the attempt to associate the valid research (well I know that despite the expertise of the researchers even this has been challenged in retrospect) over the whole experiment not just the part it actually covered to give what appears, logically, to be near madness at the close an aura of validity.

There was no reason for Mac not to be excited about the potential from the initial work.
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