Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by hiorta on Mon Apr 30, 2012 9:07 am

""There's a secret name of Silver Birch and we don't know what it is""KK

I'd suggest that if this is so, it's hardly a 'secret' The Silver Birch Group seemingly did not want any distractions from the point of their communications and if we remember the life & death stranglehold the Christianity of that day had upon the general population, anything would have been seized upon to dilute 'outside' impact.
We tend to forget that 'All Life is One' and what is out of sight is often regarded as 'gone' or in this case 'never was' by those who meet such wisdom before 'the pupil is ready'
As has been said, what's in a name?
It is my view that such communicators do not automatically leave us either upon their own, or their Mediums, transition. The spiritual power of the words of SB retain their potency.
In support of this view, a quote from 'Light from Silver Birch' compiled by Pam Riva, page 88/ 9. The discussion followed a comment by a visitor who was 'worried as to what would happen when the time came for SB's medium to pass on'.
SB advised that worry is a bad councillor and to have no fear: "Others will follow. They will have the means at their disposal of reaching far more people than we have done, because of technological devices that are to come".
The edition was printed in 1983, but the words could have been on record from long before that.



Last edited by hiorta on Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:44 am; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Additional word.)
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Wes on Tue May 01, 2012 2:40 am

In the years since Barbanell's passing, has there been any pairing of medium and spirit that has come close to continuing the work and impact of Barbanell and Silver Birch?
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Admin on Tue May 01, 2012 4:08 am

Not at that standard and consistency Wes I am not that enamoured with either the Ramadahn or Seth material.

I think it shows the value of a person who only did that in the Home Circle week after week. I think populist TV has made a follow on very unlikely unless we get truly lucky. Maybe its time, the message may not be new but the societal context would vary the presentation.
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by _Leslie_ on Tue May 01, 2012 8:46 pm

I've now had chance to download and read the article. Personally, I found it very well presented and informative. Do I believe? Well, let's say I'm leaning more to why not...
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Admin on Wed May 02, 2012 12:36 am

Now It is very interesting that Z is very much speaking against not just Paul but Roy Stemman.

I am sure no one will mind me quoting Roy's post from the article on Silver Birch in the members area of PN.

Silver Birch was, indeed, first known as "Big Jump" to members of the Hannen Swaffer home circle. And one can see why they decided that it was perhaps not an appropriate name to be associated with such words of wisdom. But I think it worth putting on record that Barbanell always referred to his spirit guide as "Big Jump" in conversation with those who were in the know, as it were – friends, colleagues and circle members.

Paul Gaunt is to be congratulated on compiling this very useful background document about one of the most impressive trance partnerships in Spiritualism's history. I'm not sure, however, that his revelation about Silver Birch's "real" name brings us any closer to knowing who he really was.

Now given Roy's long association with Maurice Barbanel, even as assistant editor of Psychic News, I am certain that he would have known. Maybe on this occasion Z was not close enough to the key people to be in the know.Certainly, from remembering the year Z said he first came to the UK to live, it may be behind the time when this may have been known to the inner group.

I also notice Roy's thoughts tend along with several of those on this thread it does not bring us any closer to who the guide really was.
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Lis on Wed May 02, 2012 2:07 am

zerdini wrote:
Lis wrote:The issue is not whether 'Silver Birch' ever revealed his "real" name, but that until his words of wisdom as transmitted through Maurice Barbanell were made public, the name by which he went in his circle was 'Big Jump' and not Silver Birch according to the record of a scribe of the circle. In historical terms that information is of significant interest and worthy of gaining wider attention as it is in a recent publication.

The issue is very much whether SB revealed his earthly identity or not as the headline in PN read. That is what caused all the controversy.
I explained before that the nickname ‘Big Jump’ was part of a joke. . . The 'scribe' (stenographer) was A.W. Austen who, for eight years, faithfully recorded the teachings spoken by Silver Birch. He was followed by Frances Moore, who together with her husband Vernon, became members of the circle.

It cannot be disputed that the header for the article in PN was "Silver Birch's real name revealed" however I note that in the editorial it is stated quite specifically:

"Last month saw the publication of a new booklet which reveals for the first time the original name of the guide whose teachings have captured the hearts of people around the globe. Much of the booklet was made possible by Geoff Griffiths' donation of original transcripts from the Hannen Swaffer Home Circle, which he salvaged following the funeral of Frances Moore, who with her husband Vernon, was a member of the famous circle." [I have emphasised in bold some key words]

The new booklet referred to is a Britten Memorial Museum publication released March 2012 and written by Paul Gaunt the Museum Curator. In that publication the section relevant to this discussion is headed "The guide was not originally called Silver Birch" and clearly records that during the formative years "the guide was known as 'Big Jump' . . . It would not be until the 1930s, after Psychic News was founded, that the name Silver Birch would come into existence."

This publication makes clear that this information is now known as a result of a note written by Frances Moore on a transcript of a message of 'Big Jump' addressing Vernon Moore, She wrote that the script was referencing the union between Frances and Vernon and that the message was given in Maurice Barbanell's flat in St Johns Wood before their wedding 25-3-39. She noted that "Silver Birch was just known by the name 'Big Jump,' but when The Teachings were printed it was thought a more suitable name should be used."

According to Frances Moore, who unlike A. W. Austen, the original stenographer, was called "the scribe" by 'Silver Birch,' the name 'Silver Birch' was decided one evening at a sitting and the following morning Barbanell received a postcard at his office with an image of a silver birch tree on the front.

While we might agree that Z is correct when he argues that the initial PN headline is incorrect or misleading, in the sense that the revelation that 'Silver Birch' was originally known as 'Big Jump' does not mean that this was 'his' real name any more than 'Silver Birch' was 'his' real name. So the identity of the spirit known initially as 'Big Jump' and later as 'Silver Birch' remains unknown.

On the other hand, bearing in mind certain emphatic remarks made by Z, to wit: "There wasn't a record nor will the story appear because there isn't one . . .," or, "I have great respect for Paul but, if he has been reported accurately, then, in this instance he is wrong," or "The words 'Big Jump' were part of a joke told by Barbanell to his circle . . ." it would seem that it is Z, on this occasion who is wrong. The record of a long-term member of the home circle, who was also the 'scribe' of that circle, given their position must surely take precedence over the understanding that Z may have gained from his much later and less close relationship with Barbanell, 'Silver Birch' and the home circle.

Added weight must also be given to the validity of the matter when Roy Stemman, again a person who worked in close association with Barbanell confirms also "Silver Birch was, indeed, first known as 'Big Jump' to members of the Hannen Swaffer home circle," especially since Stemman considers "it worth putting on record that Barbanell always referred to his spirit guide as "Big Jump" in conversation with those who were in the know, as it were – friends, colleagues and circle members." [again I have emphasised words that I believe are significant]

As Roy Stemman observes, it is unlikely we will ever know who 'Silver Birch' actually is, nevertheless, Paul Gaunt's meticulous research has revealed an interesting new insight into the past.

Lis
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Lis on Wed May 02, 2012 7:18 am

How interesting that you ignore the main thrust of my post Z. I will re-state it so there is no confusion or doubt.

Bearing in mind certain emphatic remarks made by Z, to wit:

"There wasn't a record nor will the story appear because there isn't one . . .," or,
"I have great respect for Paul but, if he has been reported accurately, then, in this instance he is wrong," or
"The words 'Big Jump' were part of a joke told by Barbanell to his circle . . ."

it would seem that it is Z, on this occasion who is wrong. The record of a long-term member of the home circle, who was also the 'scribe' of that circle, given their position must surely take precedence over the understanding that Z may have gained from his much later and less close relationship with Barbanell, 'Silver Birch' and the home circle.

Added weight must also be given to the validity of the matter when Roy Stemman, again a person who worked in close association with Barbanell confirms also "Silver Birch was, indeed, first known as 'Big Jump' to members of the Hannen Swaffer home circle," especially since Stemman considers "it worth putting on record that Barbanell always referred to his spirit guide as "Big Jump" in conversation with those who were in the know, as it were – friends, colleagues and circle members."

In other words, you have tried to maintain far more than that the real identity of 'Silver Birch'/'Big Jump' was never revealed. You have argued at first there was no record and therefore no story would appear because there wasn't one. Next, you argued that Paul Gaunt was wrong and then that the words 'Big Jump' were a joke Barbanell told his circle.

You were wrong on all counts. Quoting excerpts from publications about what 'Silver Birch' said he wasn't is irrelevant to the discussion about the original name the spirt gave.


Lis
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by zerdini on Wed May 02, 2012 7:37 am

Lis wrote:How interesting that you ignore the main thrust of my post Z. I will re-state it so there is no confusion or doubt.

Bearing in mind certain emphatic remarks made by Z, to wit:

"There wasn't a record nor will the story appear because there isn't one . . .," or,
"I have great respect for Paul but, if he has been reported accurately, then, in this instance he is wrong," or
"The words 'Big Jump' were part of a joke told by Barbanell to his circle . . ."

it would seem that it is Z, on this occasion who is wrong. The record of a long-term member of the home circle, who was also the 'scribe' of that circle, given their position must surely take precedence over the understanding that Z may have gained from his much later and less close relationship with Barbanell, 'Silver Birch' and the home circle.

Added weight must also be given to the validity of the matter when Roy Stemman, again a person who worked in close association with Barbanell confirms also "Silver Birch was, indeed, first known as 'Big Jump' to members of the Hannen Swaffer home circle," especially since Stemman considers "it worth putting on record that Barbanell always referred to his spirit guide as "Big Jump" in conversation with those who were in the know, as it were – friends, colleagues and circle members."

In other words, you have tried to maintain far more than that the real identity of 'Silver Birch'/'Big Jump' was never revealed. You have argued at first there was no record and therefore no story would appear because there wasn't one. Next, you argued that Paul Gaunt was wrong and then that the words 'Big Jump' were a joke Barbanell told his circle.

You were wrong on all counts. Quoting excerpts from publications about what 'Silver Birch' said he wasn't is irrelevant to the discussion about the original name the spirt gave.


I knew 'Big Jump' was the original name and made it clear that it was irrelevant to the teachings which were important. The point I emphasised was that Silver Birch's real name was never revealed and in the June issue of "Two Worlds" SB explains why.

I never said Paul was wrong. I said "if he has been reported accurately" which he wasn't.

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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Lis on Wed May 02, 2012 7:59 am

I will just repeat it again with emphasis:

You stated "There wasn't a record nor will the story appear because there isn't one."

You stated "I have great respect for Paul but, if he has been reported accurately, then, in this instance he is wrong."

You stated "The words 'Big Jump were part of a joke told by Barbanell to his circle"

There was a record and the story of it has appeared.
Paul was reported accurately and he was not wrong.
'Big Jump' was not a joke told by Barbanell to his circle.

Now can you please just point out to me where in your other posts you convey you "knew 'Big Jump' was the original name (and not just a joke) and made it clear it was irrelevant to the teachings which were important."

Lis
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by hiorta on Wed May 02, 2012 9:02 am

[quote="zerdini"]

Silver Birch himself stated: "I am not a Red Indian. I am using the astral body of a Red Indian because this particular one had many psychic gifts on earth and therefore became available for me when I was asked to return and engage on this mission.

"My life on earth goes back as an individual much further than the Red Indian I use to speak to you. He is just as much my medium as this medium is mine, too.

"It is not possible for people like myself, who left your world many hundreds of years ago and have achieved a certain spiritual status, to reach you and communicate on your level where the vibrations are entirely different.

"I had to have what in your world would be a transformer, someone through whom the vibrations can be stepped up or slowed down so that I can achieve communication on your level.

"At the same time, I must maintain contact with the source that inspires me and enables me to impart the knowledge that I can transmit. To give you names of tribes, places and dates would in no way establish anything that could be considered evidential because I can obtain this information so easily."

I was amazed to read these words many years ago as they seem to reveal some of the vastness of 'the spirit world', of which we are a part.
If the 'astral body' was 'available' was it in existence, but 'vacant' at the time? If so, could it be temporarily occupied for different purposes?
SB states: All is governed by Natural Law, which certainly appears to be true, although those Laws that apply to Earth seem to operate in a slower way than is said to be the case elsewhere, which in turn requires effort by the individual to realise the existence of them. 'Gravity' apart, of course.
The feeling that we are like very immature children, given some basic toys like different forms of 'mediumship' to amuse ourselves with while we try to achieve some degree of spiritual maturity, appears even more appropriate.

The beauty of SB books is that any one of them can be randomly opened to find immediate wisdom.


Last edited by hiorta on Fri May 04, 2012 6:52 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Lis on Thu May 03, 2012 1:18 am

Notice to Forum Members:

We, the administrators, have removed a post made by Z. On occasion Z plays a fine game of semantics with the unfortunate effect of obscuring and sidetracking a topic. If Z attempts to re-post his comments it will again be removed.

Unless posts on this thread now move on to more positive discussion of the issues that are raised by the fact that the original name given was Big Jump and not Silver Birch, and by the fact that the members of the home circle apparently decided that original name was not suitable for public consumption, the thread will be locked.

Admin

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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by hiorta on Thu May 03, 2012 10:01 am

The term 'Big Jump' is entirely appropriate, I would suggest.
The Sphere naturally inhabited by Silver Birch/ Big Jump must indeed have required a very big jump to reach us here.
The giant leap in outlook and wisdom which he brought with him has been warmly welcomed by so many, across various cultures, in the interim.

In any case, 'Big Jump' would have been a translation from, presumably, his mother tongue.
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Lis on Thu May 03, 2012 10:10 am

I think one can also see the name as appropriate in another way as well Hiorta - the spirit who came to communicate was to present the world with a 'big jump' in knowledge and wisdom. He would be bringing a level of truth, in gentle words and thoughtful explanations, that was (and is) aimed at moving us forward as spiritual beings.

I agree, 'Big Jump' would have been a translation from the native language that the Indian 'astral' spirit form would have spoken. I wonder whether 'Big Jump' ever conveyed what 'tribe' the Indian persona was associated with?

Lis
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Lis on Thu May 03, 2012 10:15 am

One might also see the name as a delightful nudge to Barbanell who at the beginning was a non-believer and sceptical, but who was obliged to make a 'big jump' from scepticism to belief by his involvement with the spirit that communicated through him!

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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by _Leslie_ on Thu May 03, 2012 1:25 pm

Lis wrote:One might also see the name as a delightful nudge to Barbanell who at the beginning was a non-believer and sceptical, but who was obliged to make a 'big jump' from scepticism to belief by his involvement with the spirit that communicated through him!
Now that certainly does warrant consideration - nice line of thought there Lis Wink
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by petal34 on Thu May 03, 2012 1:51 pm

...and what more proof could anyone wish for?
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by KatyKing on Thu May 03, 2012 2:32 pm

'She shoots she scores'!

darts
I reckon you could have hit the bullseye there Lis.
What you say makes sense because initially Barbie was a very reluctant instrument by all accounts.
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by zerdini on Thu May 03, 2012 7:28 pm

Admin Notice:

Zerdini was clearly advised that further remarks along the line he was taking would be removed. His attempt to again post comments which are neither appropriate nor relevant to this thread must be seen as a deliberate flaunting of the decision of the administrators. If Zerdini wishes to equate our actions with those of Robin Foy, one might well wonder why he is bothering to remain a member of this forum. We would remind forum members we rarely step in, edit or remove posts but as the owners and administrators of this forum retain the right to do so. If any forum member has concerns or a complaint the appropriate action is to contact the administrators directly by a pm.

Having said that, and despite the fact that his posting of an “unsolicited email from a doctor in Australia” seems a self-serving attempt to boost is own status, the main body of the email contents would undoubtedly be of some relevance to those interested in physical mediumship, despite the fact that its points are somewhat undermined by the authorship of the email being with-held. The email has therefore been moved to the Physical Mediumship thread under the new topic ‘Comments of an Australian Doctor.’

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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Mark74 on Thu May 03, 2012 8:59 pm

''Silver Birch himself stated: "I am not a Red Indian. I am using the astral body of a Red Indian because this particular one had many psychic gifts on earth and therefore became available for me when I was asked to return and engage on this mission''. Now thats interesting zerdini, I have all of Silver Birch's books, do you know what book the above is from.

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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Lis on Fri May 04, 2012 12:26 am

Mark74

I too, would be interested to be reminded where the quote is from.

I am also rather intrigued by the content of the quote as the idea of there being an "astral body" of a Red Indian that had many psychic gifts when in the physical realms but which is somehow 'unoccupied' once in the spiritual dimensions and therefore available to be 'inhabited' by another spirit seems somewhat strange to me. It also seems to rather borrow from concepts more usually associated with Theosophical beliefs.

It would, therefore, be interesting to know more about this aspect of 'Silver Birch's' perspective.

Lis
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Admin on Fri May 04, 2012 12:27 am

Thanks to Lis for sorting that out, I was unable to get to the computer so Lis and I were communicating regularly about this matter to make an appropriate decision. I make it clear I was fully involved and totally agree with the points she made. Let us take this topic forward in the way she had already suggested. Personally I may open a new thread on Spirit Guides in that area of the forum.

The reason is the very many interesting issues that can relate to Guides. In this particular case was a circle decision, that the name was not appropriate for the public correct, or was there Spirit Inspiration involved with the story already mentioned about the Silver Birch? In other cases it is rare that our Guides ever make claims about an earthly existence. Indeed, in one well documented case of a current medium claiming a real physical life for their guides, the facts show that the guides involved never existed as they claim. However this is a deeper and broader discussion than the events surrounding the change of name from Big Jump.
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Wes on Fri May 04, 2012 1:32 am

Mark74 wrote:''Silver Birch himself stated: "I am not a Red Indian. I am using the astral body of a Red Indian because this particular one had many psychic gifts on earth and therefore became available for me when I was asked to return and engage on this mission''. Now thats interesting zerdini, I have all of Silver Birch's books, do you know what book the above is from.

Although I dont recall that actual quote, I do remember Silver Birch has described the process that our loved ones go through in order to communicate with us, which is similar. As we shed our physical skins when we move on, we need to recreate that sense of our physical selves when communicating with loved ones on earth. That is how mediums get a sense of someone's mannerisms, their physical state when they died, and so on - by sensing that recreation of someone's physical presence and personality. Could this process of replicating a physical persona be the "astral body" mentioned above? And that as long as we remain connected to earth, that astral body, or blueprint, remains our property and only we can use it. So to extrapolate this a bit further, when the soul that once "owned" the astral body of the red indian moved on to fresh pastures, it then became available for Silver Birch/Big Jump to replicate as his chosen presence (presumably with the original owner's permission).

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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Lis on Fri May 04, 2012 1:41 am

I see your point Wes, but then how could 'Big Jump'/'Silver Birch' utilise the "many psychic gifts" of the "Red Indian" if that was the case. I cannot see how the psychic abilities of a person would remain with a discarded 'astral body'?

In Theosophical terms all mediums ever connect with are the 'astral remmant' of a person, not the real spirit that has gone on in the spirit realms - in other words, in Theosophical terms the 'astral body is nothing more than a shell of memories which does not and cannot contain a 'living' spirit.

Lis
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Wes on Fri May 04, 2012 1:43 am

Maybe it's like jumping in somebody else's car that they have lent you - you're not the original driver, but all the car's features and abilities are accesible to you...
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Re: Silver Birch's real name was Big Jump

Post by Lis on Fri May 04, 2012 1:45 am

interesting point Wes!

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