Spiritualism is it in decline

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Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by jock on Sat Jun 25, 2011 10:04 am

http://www.cfpf.org.uk/articles/religion/spiritualist.html
Jock McArthur
There is a debate going on around the web sites about Spiritualism (is it in decline) I think not especialy where Dunfermline Ask is concerned. Here is a link to Michael Rolls site it is food for thought and you can spend hours within his site

www.cfpf.org.uk
The Campaign for Philosophical Freedom. The scientific proof that we all survive the death of our physical bodies.
http://www.voy.com/225276/39.html

jock


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by hiorta on Sat Jun 25, 2011 11:04 am

A perennial question Jock. Change is the natural order and as we ourselves change, the opinions we hold are viewed from a changing perspective, which could appear as 'decline'.

Great question, though. Who could fully evaluate it?
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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by mac on Sat Jun 25, 2011 11:17 am

It would need a global perspective, or at least a national one, to assess the fortunes of Modern Spiritualism.

I doubt that Dunfermline ASK is nationally representative although it's cheering to hear that its fortunes appear to be going well.

mac


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by Quiet on Sun Jul 31, 2011 7:29 pm

If one can find a spiritualist community that is supportive and knowledgeable, that would be wonderful.

The spiritualist philosophy is beautiful and there is much literature through trance revelations to support it.

But spiritualism needs good mediumship, I think.

Quiet


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by petal34 on Mon Aug 01, 2011 2:51 pm

Lot of the spiritualist sites are flagging as well.
Once I could remember numerous sites,full of interesting topics.

There are still the interesting topics but not the interest,I feel.
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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by Quiet on Sat Aug 06, 2011 6:16 pm

petal34 wrote:Lot of the spiritualist sites are flagging as well.
Once I could remember numerous sites,full of interesting topics.

There are still the interesting topics but not the interest,I feel.

Spiritualism gave me such hope a few years ago. It is all I have, really. Fortunately there is a wealth of literature.

I belonged to a church but there was awful conflict within it and I left. It seems that these things happen more frequently and maybe spirit will seek other ways than churches to manifest to oncoming generations.

Quiet


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by hiorta on Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:24 pm

Quiet, I hope that you don't mind me saying so, but you seem to be perfectly positioned to put what has been gained from your time in Spiritualism, to pave the way ahead for you.

We must always 'leave' the comforts of home, first of all, then school and latterly, Church.

We are now equipped - although it mightn't seem so - to move ahead into uncharted waters, relying on all that has been gained in knowledge and experience and linking with our friends on the Higher side, begin to serve others. By doing so, we too benefit.

Courage in both hands - go for it - you have graduated.
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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by petal34 on Sun Aug 07, 2011 7:40 am

Quiet wrote:
petal34 wrote:Lot of the spiritualist sites are flagging as well.
Once I could remember numerous sites,full of interesting topics.

There are still the interesting topics but not the interest,I feel.

Spiritualism gave me such hope a few years ago. It is all I have, really. Fortunately there is a wealth of literature.

I belonged to a church but there was awful conflict within it and I left. It seems that these things happen more frequently and maybe spirit will seek other ways than churches to manifest to oncoming generations.

I often wonder why there is so much conflict in spiritualist churches?
When the main point of this religion should be peaceful at the thought of a happy passing into the afterlife.
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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by Quiet on Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:39 pm

hiorta wrote:Quiet, I hope that you don't mind me saying so, but you seem to be perfectly positioned to put what has been gained from your time in Spiritualism, to pave the way ahead for you.

We must always 'leave' the comforts of home, first of all, then school and latterly, Church.

We are now equipped - although it mightn't seem so - to move ahead into uncharted waters, relying on all that has been gained in knowledge and experience and linking with our friends on the Higher side, begin to serve others. By doing so, we too benefit.

Courage in both hands - go for it - you have graduated.

Thank you, hiorta. I was only a Church member for a couple of years, and it was the mediumship which drew me in. There was not a lot in the Church community itself, though I wanted there to be.

However, I am drawn to absent healing and the study of other forms of mediumship. Also the study of other kinds of literature and philosophy. I sit in a development circle which is aimed at evidential mediumship but something is missing in that circle for me. I miss the presence of well developed mediums and the constant contact with spirit.

I feel that I must commence another kind of development soon - something more ascetic and contemplative. I know about the value of service but it seems that the only way I can do this is through healing.

Quiet


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by Quiet on Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:57 pm

petal34 wrote:
I often wonder why there is so much conflict in spiritualist churches?
When the main point of this religion should be peaceful at the thought of a happy passing into the afterlife.

There is always conflict in human groups. If the conflict is managed wisely and respectfully it can lead to closeness and growth but often people don't know how to do this. Leadership in Churches is important as well. Often that is not there in a natural sense.

I think that possibly we are intended to learn how to live with each other and we struggle sometimes, especially if we have come from life times of conflict and a society which is often about aggressive self-promotion and advancement. People are often convinced, also, that their way is the only way.

Something really simple helped me recently. I read somewhere that if we could act as if we are already in Spirit, life would be much easier. And if we are truly aware of the Divine within we would act very differently.

I love some of the Sufi work and found this lovely poem in Daniel Ladinksy's collection: Love Poems from God. It is by the female poet, Rabia of Basra. She lived in the 8th century and was reportedly a great influence on Rumi. I come from a Catholic background initially and there is not a lot of difference between Islamic mystics and Catholic mystics.

Jealous of a pond

When God said, "My hands are yours," I saw that I could heal any
creature in the world;

I saw that the divine beauty in each heart
us the root of all time
and space.

I was once a sleeping ocean
and in a dream became
jealous of a
pond.

A penny can be eyed in the street
and a war can break out
over it amongst
the poor.

Until we know that God lives in us
and can see Him
there,

A great poverty
we suffer.


Quiet


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by petal34 on Sun Aug 07, 2011 7:16 pm

What a lovely poem,Quiet.
I liked that very much because it says so a lot.
Very Happy
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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by hiorta on Wed Nov 23, 2011 11:44 am

Meditation this morning opened some thoughts on the current state of Spiritualism:

The passing of the spiritualism which brought so much of tremendous value to a relative few is not to be mourned - it is not deceased.

Spiritualism once reached the dozens, but the millions were in darkness.

Now, that basic spiritual knowledge is more to the forefront of everyday mind, attempts are being made to reach out to the great many who are feeling desparately lost and bewildered, especially in a time of steadily worsening material conditions.

Many live in great fear for what tomorrow might bring. They see their gains of the immediate past slip from their helpless grasp. They see only darkness ahead as the bright lights of materialism dim. Despair descends. Their leaders have abandoned them to their economic fate and try to fool them with meaningless visual frippery.

They are, in the main, totally oblivious to Spiritual Reality.

The opportunities that the approaching conditions afford for piercing the dense fog that obscures eternal verities are often aided by an inner upheaveal, of material shock, that rocks the very foundations of existence as it was understood. It is to be hoped that, having plumbed their depths, a deeper sense of Reality will find a toehold and the millions can benefit as the dozens once did.

First though, there had to be instruments willing to bring Spiritual Truth into everyday awareness. The 'quality' of the instruments will match the embryo understanding that may begin to fill the void in the hearts of the materially dispossessed.
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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by mac on Wed Nov 23, 2011 12:13 pm

quote="hiorta"
Meditation this morning opened some thoughts on the current state of Spiritualism: Mine brought the following reactions...

The passing of the spiritualism which brought so much of tremendous value to a relative few is not to be mourned - it is not deceased. Not deceased but the prognosis isn't good....

Spiritualism once reached the dozens, but the millions were in darkness. Yes, once reached dozens but now, perhaps, even fewer...?

Now, that basic spiritual knowledge is more to the forefront of everyday mind, attempts are being made to reach out to the great many who are feeling desparately lost and bewildered, especially in a time of steadily worsening material conditions. I hope the attempts will be successful....

Many live in great fear for what tomorrow might bring. They see their gains of the immediate past slip from their helpless grasp. They see only darkness ahead as the bright lights of materialism dim. Despair descends. Their leaders have abandoned them to their economic fate and try to fool them with meaningless visual frippery. yes - same as it ever was....

They are, in the main, totally oblivious to Spiritual Reality. indeed....

The opportunities that the approaching conditions afford for piercing the dense fog that obscures eternal verities are often aided by an inner upheaveal, of material shock, that rocks the very foundations of existence as it was understood. It is to be hoped that, having plumbed their depths, a deeper sense of Reality will find a toehold and the millions can benefit as the dozens once did. Yes, it is to be hoped but is there any indication of anything concrete?

First though, there had to be instruments willing to bring Spiritual Truth into everyday awareness. The 'quality' of the instruments will match the embryo understanding that may begin to fill the void in the hearts of the materially dispossessed. ooer Crying or Very sad The quality will match an embryonic understanding that may begin - future tense? This sounds like the instruments will communicate very basic levels of support and help.

Is this your glimpse, hiorta, into what's coming in the future decades?

mac


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by Quiet on Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:11 pm

hiorta wrote:Meditation this morning opened some thoughts on the current state of Spiritualism:

The passing of the spiritualism which brought so much of tremendous value to a relative few is not to be mourned - it is not deceased.

Spiritualism once reached the dozens, but the millions were in darkness.

Now, that basic spiritual knowledge is more to the forefront of everyday mind, attempts are being made to reach out to the great many who are feeling desparately lost and bewildered, especially in a time of steadily worsening material conditions.

Many live in great fear for what tomorrow might bring. They see their gains of the immediate past slip from their helpless grasp. They see only darkness ahead as the bright lights of materialism dim. Despair descends. Their leaders have abandoned them to their economic fate and try to fool them with meaningless visual frippery.

They are, in the main, totally oblivious to Spiritual Reality.

The opportunities that the approaching conditions afford for piercing the dense fog that obscures eternal verities are often aided by an inner upheaveal, of material shock, that rocks the very foundations of existence as it was understood. It is to be hoped that, having plumbed their depths, a deeper sense of Reality will find a toehold and the millions can benefit as the dozens once did.

First though, there had to be instruments willing to bring Spiritual Truth into everyday awareness. The 'quality' of the instruments will match the embryo understanding that may begin to fill the void in the hearts of the materially dispossessed.

Gandhi said ' Be the change that you want in the world.'

Individually, we can change things by living with hope and love, given what we know. Perhaps we are heading to a time of great material loss though another global financial crisis or through the impacts of climate change. Who knows?

Spiritualism has a philosophy of love and service. It acknowledges, teaches and practises the art of evidential mediumship. Through both these things, spiritualism can still make a difference and spiritualist communities can still be very meaningful to people.

I have experienced kindness from people here, hiorta, including yourself, and I carry that with me in a very real sense. It is those little things that make a world of difference, every day.

Quiet


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by obiwan on Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:14 pm

Quiet wrote:
hiorta wrote:Meditation this morning opened some thoughts on the current state of Spiritualism:

The passing of the spiritualism which brought so much of tremendous value to a relative few is not to be mourned - it is not deceased.

Spiritualism once reached the dozens, but the millions were in darkness.

Now, that basic spiritual knowledge is more to the forefront of everyday mind, attempts are being made to reach out to the great many who are feeling desparately lost and bewildered, especially in a time of steadily worsening material conditions.

Many live in great fear for what tomorrow might bring. They see their gains of the immediate past slip from their helpless grasp. They see only darkness ahead as the bright lights of materialism dim. Despair descends. Their leaders have abandoned them to their economic fate and try to fool them with meaningless visual frippery.

They are, in the main, totally oblivious to Spiritual Reality.

The opportunities that the approaching conditions afford for piercing the dense fog that obscures eternal verities are often aided by an inner upheaveal, of material shock, that rocks the very foundations of existence as it was understood. It is to be hoped that, having plumbed their depths, a deeper sense of Reality will find a toehold and the millions can benefit as the dozens once did.

First though, there had to be instruments willing to bring Spiritual Truth into everyday awareness. The 'quality' of the instruments will match the embryo understanding that may begin to fill the void in the hearts of the materially dispossessed.

Gandhi said ' Be the change that you want in the world.'

Individually, we can change things by living with hope and love, given what we know. Perhaps we are heading to a time of great material loss though another global financial crisis or through the impacts of climate change. Who knows?

Spiritualism has a philosophy of love and service. It acknowledges, teaches and practises the art of evidential mediumship. Through both these things, spiritualism can still make a difference and spiritualist communities can still be very meaningful to people.

I have experienced kindness from people here, hiorta, including yourself, and I carry that with me in a very real sense. It is those little things that make a world of difference, every day.
Well put.

obiwan


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by hiorta on Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:34 pm

""Is this your glimpse, hiorta, into what's coming in the future decades? Mac.

I cannot see the future mac, which depends very much on what transpired yesterday and today.

Experience suggests that 'futures' rarely unfold as was planned, as Robert Burns observed in "To a Mouse", but it is reasonable to extrapolate likelihood in some cases.

For example: a Nation who has a centuries-long history of terrorising others and who has amassed a huge store of destructive weapons, with the armadas to deliver them, together with many people in standing armies and who imposes harsh taxation to finance it all, is unlikely to change without some external compulsion.

I'd say that was a reasonable conclusion to draw.

Quiet, Agreed absolutely. Silver Birch said that the aim of the Spirit World in his mission was not for mass conversions, but by love and an appeal to individual reason.
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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by mac on Wed Nov 23, 2011 5:34 pm

[quote="hiorta"]""Is this your glimpse, hiorta, into what's coming in the future decades? Mac.

I cannot see the future mac, which depends very much on what transpired yesterday and today.

Experience suggests that 'futures' rarely unfold as was planned, as Robert Burns observed in "To a Mouse", but it is reasonable to extrapolate likelihood in some cases.

I asked because of your use of the future tense in your earlier piece, viz "The 'quality' of the instruments will match the embryo understanding that may begin to fill the void in the hearts of the materially dispossessed." I had thought you were being impressed in your meditation with what will/might happen in future times, some time.

If not then I've misunderstood.

mac


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by hiorta on Sat Nov 26, 2011 11:05 am

""First though, there had to be instruments willing to bring Spiritual Truth into everyday awareness. The 'quality' of the instruments will match the embryo understanding that may begin to fill the void in the hearts of the materially dispossessed. ooer Crying or Very sad The quality will match an embryonic understanding that may begin - future tense? This sounds like the instruments will communicate very basic levels of support and help.""mac.



mac, I've had a chance to try to see your point in the above text.

It looks like a simle cross-purposes situation in that the thought tried to convey a wide, general situation in that not every one caught up in change will respond in the same way. Some will be angry, some aggressive, some will prey on the weaker, some will see crime as a solution. Not all will try to see the bigger picture - hence 'will' and 'may'.

If I could offer a little explanation, there is no piece of prose that will be 'read' in exactly the same way by everyone. Things like this come as a 'lump' to be spread then written before the thoughts fade, capturing the meaning as fully as possible.

A difficulty is that I'm a one-fingered typerer and I have a broken finger on the same hand that cannot be repaired as the middle joint has fragmented. It is in trying to write and keep pace with the thoughts that pose problems.


Last edited by hiorta on Sat Nov 26, 2011 11:08 am; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Trying to change text colour to black)
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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by mac on Sat Nov 26, 2011 2:12 pm

hiorta wrote:""First though, there had to be instruments willing to bring Spiritual Truth into everyday awareness. The 'quality' of the instruments will match the embryo understanding that may begin to fill the void in the hearts of the materially dispossessed. ooer Crying or Very sad The quality will match an embryonic understanding that may begin - future tense? This sounds like the instruments will communicate very basic levels of support and help.""mac.



mac, I've had a chance to try to see your point in the above text.

It looks like a simle cross-purposes situation in that the thought tried to convey a wide, general situation in that not every one caught up in change will respond in the same way. Some will be angry, some aggressive, some will prey on the weaker, some will see crime as a solution. Not all will try to see the bigger picture - hence 'will' and 'may'.

If I could offer a little explanation, there is no piece of prose that will be 'read' in exactly the same way by everyone. Things like this come as a 'lump' to be spread then written before the thoughts fade, capturing the meaning as fully as possible.

A difficulty is that I'm a one-fingered typerer and I have a broken finger on the same hand that cannot be repaired as the middle joint has fragmented. It is in trying to write and keep pace with the thoughts that pose problems.

thanks for trying again Smile I admit I was puzzled at what you wrote. When reading your pieces that's very unusual for me as you write very well.

But in it was a curious mix of tenses and I couldn't figure if you'd related a verbatim account of something communicated to you in meditation rather than a piece you'd written from your own ideas and thoughts. The mention of the meditation itself also puzzled me - did you intend that it had a deeper importance than do your own ideas, for instance?

Although I had underlined 'will' (I thought as future tense) I also underlined 'begin', again suggesting (to me) the future....

It seems I was reading too literally but that's the way I work. Wink

mac


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by hiorta on Sat Nov 26, 2011 3:17 pm

No, mac. I just pass these things on for discarding or consideration as folk please.

I find meditation beneficial and often thoughts have 'gone' before I can grasp even the gist of the substance.
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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by seraphina on Mon Nov 28, 2011 6:24 pm

At one time SPiritualism was beacon for truth not now at the moment for if this country is to go by than Spiritualism is in bad trouble. Spiritualism was iniated by Spirit with the gift f Mediumship which alas is very close to nonexistent in many spiritual churches. If one has sat in churcues for the last ten years then one cannot fail to notice that Mediumship has been replace by psychicism. Many of us listen to what passes for communication and tut but we do nothing about it. I am not here for to win friends but writ hopefully for the upsurge of decent Mediumship agaon. but that needs good medium/Teachers who know what they are doing as to communicating with SPirit. If there are no genuine Mediums how can Psychics teach communication when all they can do is glean from the auric field It will perpetuate psychicism. It is up to the authorities - but wait - they are not stirring from their gilded palaces to help their subjects. Spirit will overcome.

seraphina


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Re: Spiritualism is it in decline

Post by Admin on Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:14 pm

Hi Seraphina,

What we need is to persuade some of the retired mediums to start up and open home groups. The trouble is you need, firstly to work out who is most likely to have the combination of abilities needed to becomespeaker and medium. Once this step is achieved its is who has teh capacity to then become a teacher.

Running an open group I am well aware that part of this is also to see who is likely to become a Spiritualist. The majority of new attendees here have only an experience of the broad new age. Sometimes that is one thing which we cannot change and they move on or work outside the movement however tallnted.
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